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Vancouver 911 Hearings

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Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:01 am

The 911 Vancouver Hearings (15 - 17 June 2012) will have a session on the WTC. I will be one of the speakers, presenting "Assessing Alternate Theories About the Twin Towers." One of the theories I plan to include will be primarily based on ROOSD.

In subsequent posts, I will post several slides I plan to use, together with briefing notes. Any comments and suggestions will be appreciated.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:09 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (1 of 10).pdf
The ROOSD theory takes into account the somewhat unique open office space design aspect. The lower three points capture the primary feature of this type of destruction.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:11 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (2 of 10).pdf
The ROOSD theory, as described by “Major_Tom” does not include the “Explosives” part. It does not try to determine if explosives were involved to initiate the collapse. I made the inclusion of explosives explicit, so it would be easier to compare with the other theories.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:13 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (3 of 10).pdf
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:14 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (4 of 10).pdf
Here is the first issue, Crush Rates. This is the wave of destruction down the faces of the Towers. The ROOSD reference describes it as the “collapse front propagation rate.” On the southwest corner of WTC 1, the downward velocity has been measured, with the red line showing the curve fit. It settles out at 8 stories/sec. Also noted on the website, adjacent sides to the corner settle on different rates. Also noted, the rates correlate with the floor-load capacities explained in the next slide.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:15 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (5 of 10).pdf
This is a typical floor diagram as contained in NIST NCSTAR 1-2A. Looking only at the OOS floors, the live loads design spec is different for the size and location of the different floor sections, 82.5, 55, and 75 PSF. The crushing of the floors was without respect to the status of the columns, as they were all solidly in place. In the most extreme case, the northern part of WTC 1 core remained standing up to the 50th floor (what has become known as the “spire”). It remained standing for several seconds after the floors had come down, and the perimeter columns had pealed away.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:17 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (6 of 10).pdf
The second issue is Debris Patterns. These are the debris patterns reported by NOAA. There are differences between the various faces of the two Towers. Close examination reveals a connection between debris patterns and certain Open Office Space floor features.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:18 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (7 of 10).pdf
This diagram lays out schematically along the bottom the eight faces of the two towers. Also shown is the core orientation within each tower. For reference, the key neighboring buildings are shown, their faces at the proper distance from the nearest tower.

“Major_Tom” has detected differences in crush rates (ROOSD fronts) associated with OSS span-truss lengths and a bias favoring one side. In the case of Tower 1, the long-span trusses are on the north and south side, and the bias favors the south side. This produces a leading ROOSD front, similarly for the east face of Tower 2.

The walls with lagging ROOSD fronts are the remaining long-span truss faces are the north of Tower 1, and the west of Tower 2.

All of the short-span truss faces have uneven ROOSD fronts, varying as much as 20 stories between one side and the other.

Why is all of this important? Because, there is a degree of control and direction of the debris patterns depending on the bias.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:19 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (8 of 10).pdf
This is a little different depiction of the eight tower walls. The yellow dots are the falls with leading ROOSD fronts (biased that way). The orange are lagging. Asterisks are walls with uneven ROOSD fronts.

It appears from the evidence that the droppings (LONG or SHORT) can be (or were) controlled by manipulating the stiffness of the bands at the MER (Mechanical Equipment Rooms) levels. For example, Tower 2 east wall (a leading ROOSD front), with a failure line just above the MER between the 74th and 78th floors had a single vertical break in both MER levels. Apparently, a single break left the MER stiffness intact. The result, a LONG drop.

In another example, Tower 2 west wall, lagging ROOSD front, had three vertical breaks in the 74-78 MER band. Breaks included ejections of band sections still connected to floor sections. Presumedly, this destroyed the stiffness of the band, and affected stiffness of the 30-story wall section. The result -- a SHORT drop.

A third example, Tower 1 west wall this time, and an uneven ROOSD front, and higher failure line. Because of the uneven front, the wall twisted before pealing away. The result -- a LONG drop, but a bit shorter because of the twist.

The next slide will show the two LONG drop examples.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:21 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (9 of 10).pdf
The above descriptions explain how two walls, one from each tower, and with different ROOSD front conditions, can be made to drop LONG.

A more detailed description of how the collapses of the various wall situations can be studied under the “Single Wall Collapse Model” on the ROOSD website. A large collection of debris and collapse photos are available on the website to reinforce the model’s consistency with the debris details.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:22 am

[pdf][/pdf]
Attachments

Vancouver ROOSD (10 of 10).pdf
Here are the debris patterns. The two leading patterns go with the biases. The short-span truss sides, such as Tower 2 south side, have the perimeter faces pealing away from the bias. Because of the twisting, the drop distance is further constrained.

This all may be evidence of demolition professionals at work, selecting initiating forces to minimize damage to certain neighboring buildings. If such a demolition was done, it appears to have been much more surgical than most CD advocates believe.
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby SanderO » Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:47 am


wtc debris + photo 3.pdf
100' distance *rings* and debris ejecta canopies
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Thank you for having the courage to present ROOSD at the Vancouver hearings. Jim Fetzer is well away of it as a result of my hundreds of posts about it on a DEEP POLITCS thread titled "Where did the Towers Go?" It was the longest thread with a lot of acrimony and sent to their "bear pit" but it still can be read and contains a good discussion and debate.

Interesting presentation. I don't think the slides properly represent the key features of ROOSD. Your slides seem to focus solely on the behavior of the *walls* which, by the way is a poor term for the facade columns assemblies which were load bearing and supported more than 50% of the axial loads.

There is no evidence of the facade falling further than 440 feet from either tower and that was the panels from the West facade of tower 1 which landed over at the WFC and the Winter Garden.

ROOSD is the collapse mechanism as you suggest but the mechanism of initiation is not part of ROOSD. The ROOSD began as a result of core failure at the plane strike zones which then led to the collapse from BUCKLING of the last surviving columns which were then unable to support the mass above the strike zone region and the section above collapsed down. In so doing it allowed the 16 or 30 stories of building above the buckling zone to deliver the threshold kick off mass to begin the ROOSD which was not a progression of floor slabs being separated and then dropping from the columns one after the other, but an avalanche of debris which destroyed each slab... fracturing, crushing ripping the trusses and concrete from the truss seats which supported it. The ROOSD, in destroying the floor slabs left the facade and many of the core columns behind as it raced downward within what was the cage-like structure of the facade.

The caging and ROOSD destruction and dropping left the facade laterally unsupported as the floor system had provided the required lateral stability to the facade. The floors also transmitted lateral wind loads to the stiff core as part of the strategy to provide stiffness to the tower. The growing collapsing floor mass was also exerting an outward force at the inside of the facade *cage* ...at its descending bottom and this plus Euler instability of the increasing slenderness ratio (1/12 in the intact tower to over 1/400 in some instances) led the facade to bulge and separating its panels at the connections of one panel to another and then the toppling away from the facade of large assemblies of panels. The larger the number of panels remaining attached to each other the further they fell from the tower (height location obviously determined how far they landed as well). There were many single panels which broke away and smaller number of panel assemblies which remained as a unit and these fell close to the tower.

ROOSD also stripped the core of much if its bracing. The core was a 3D lattice like structure (steel frame) and required bracing to stand erect. Steel wide flange beams were the bracing used to maintain the core's integrity. No bracing .. the core cannot stand. The core columns, like the facade was assembled from 36' long steel sections (not staggered however as the facade *membrane*), and was built of both fabricated box sections and cold rolled WF shapes. All columns reduced in cross sectional areas and were of decreasing strength the higher in the tower they were. The collapsing ROOSD debris/mass broke much of the bracing at the weak beam stub connections leaving the columns without lateral support and only held *in column* by the weaker splice plates at their end-to-end connections. These columns were growing increasingly *slender* and their slenderness ratio was increasing (from its original braced 1/12 to as much as 1/480+ without bracing) as the bracing was progressively stripped away by the ROOSD moving down the structure.

No columns were crushed by ROOSD, but all eventually buckled or toppled from Euler described forces after the ROOSD had concluded. Some were broken free during ROOSD and added to the ROOSD mass. These surviving columns are seen in the collapse videos and one, cc501 of tower 1 stood 78 stories much of it with no lateral support at all. Many core columns survived the ROOSD standing about 50 stories before they succumbed to EULER buckling (excessive slenderness ratio).

Most of the ejections seen emerging from the windows as the ROOSD raced down the tower caged by the facade were ahead of the front of ROOSD destruction. This material is most likely the contents of the floors being pushed outward (it had no other place to go) as the floor slab above this floor came down in about .1 seconds. Each floor contained 18,000 cubic yards of air which had to be displaced and the rapid displacement or 18,000 cu yard of air on the floor to the outside through the windows (smashing them of course) created huge over pressure and very destructive winds of up to 400 mph in a .1 second pulse. The window ejections are likely NOT the concrete from the slabs.

The driving ROOSD mass was the floor concrete and other heavy objects such as the hat truss steel, mech floor steel, antenna parts or heavy mechanical equipment... this made up the growing and gathering avalanche material. ROOSD was NOT PANCAKES... it was a rolling mixing vertical avalanche of self grinding materials. It was not a pile of dust, nor only massive sections of slabs. Each ROOSD impact with the floor it descended upon caused more crushing and fracturing of the ROOSD mass itself. Each 4" slab was fractured in small fraction of .1 seconds between floor impacts.

The threshold ROOSD mass has not been precisely determined. But the typical twin tower floor was designed to support 58 psf live load (reduced by request of PANY from the NYC Code requirement of 100 psf). The mass which came down on the top intact slab was north of 30,000 tons in tower 1 and more than double in tower 2.

The NIST diagram you cited is incorrect. The OOS slabs were of uniform spec... the spans of areas of the slabs varied and so the loads on the truss seat supports would vary depending on the slab load presented to the truss seat... and so the short spans had less load on the truss seats which, being the same design as the long span truss supports therefore had a larger safety factor... the slabs were the same spec for the entire pour/area. The corner sections were supported on truss seats on 2 adjacent sides and a transfer truss bearing on the corners of the core and one column location at the facade. See the attached slide which indicates approximate loading at each truss seat. The cited NIST analysis/diagram is rubbish.

It is important to note that the core side of the floor system supported the trusses on a *belt girder* which encircled the core and the belt girder was supported on beam stub outlookers and these same outlookers are also the means for attaching the inside the core bracing. The bolted connections of the outlookers was what failed in many cases. Beam stub outlookers are one the most common method used to make a rigid moment connection. A bearing seat connection allows rotation and movement.

Tom's analysis arrived at the ROOSD mechanism using an examination of how the facade (and the surviving core) behaved... plus it includes the observations of the descending crush front inside the facade cage. ROOSD is derived from observation but it has been described in engineering literature. Tom did not invent ROOSD but he has given it an acronym.'

It is stunning that neither NIST nor the professional engineering community has mentioned the ROOSD explanation.

The falling /peeling /pushing away of the facade was a ROOSD artifact. The columns of the towers both facade and core could neither prevent or contribute to the ROOSD process... but they were both victims of ROOSD in the end. ROOSD did not crush or buckle any columns... it was the destruction mechanism of the floor system and the towers cannot stand without their floors.

ROOSD is self sustaining once the threshold conditions present and requires no connection joint weakening of the truss seats or of the columns connections one to another.

Thank you for presenting this important work at the conference. If you would like to use any of my slides you can contact me.
Attachments

wtc debris + photo 4.pdf
Distance Rings and Ejecta Canopy
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Spire -cc 501.pdf
Euler Buckling Illustration
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Moment Connection.pdf
cartoon of typical out-looker steel beam moment connection- assorted connection methods illustrated
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core beam stubs.pdf
plan detail of beam stub support for belt girder
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OOS core loads r2.pdf
Approximate design loading of typical OOS floor
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby dadeets » Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:22 pm

There may be more important ROOSD topics to cover. However, I have picked nine issues as representative of a much larger number of issues pertaining to the TT destructions.

1. Crush rates
2. Debris patterns
3. Nanothermite
4. Temperatures (immediate)
5. Persistent heat
6. Vehicle anomalies
7. Tritium
8. Basement blasts
9. Radionuclides
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby SanderO » Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:55 pm

The only basement explosion report I am aware of was that of William Rodriguez. I did speak with him on the telephone conference and he clearly stated that his testimony is that he heard AN EXPLOSION not a bomb or bombs.

He was interviewed by Sofia Smallstorm for her CD/movie she produced 911 Mysteries http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwayjX4ipFc. I've spoken with Sofia on a number of occasions as well. She is not an engineer nor a scientist only reporting what she *learns* from other sources (the familiar problem). Sofia told me that William Rodriquez told her (several times) that the blast he heard came about 1 second before he *experienced* the plane striking the tower 1100 feet above him.

If his estimate of the time is reasonably accurate then the explosion was actually the moment (time or close to it) of the plane strike and the plane strike SOUND was heard about 1 second AFTER it had struck the tower as sound travels 1,180 feet per second through air and it took place 1100+ feet above him.

This suggests to me that the sound of the explosion likely was an electrical explosion caused by the plane strike shorting out 138 KV feeder cables to the mech floor on 108 which ran from main electrical switch gear in the sub basement.

The explosion did cause fires and damage and I believe several workers emerged from the service elevator who were injured as a result of the explosion.

But we don't actually know what caused the explosion...
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Re: Vancouver 911 Hearings

Postby ozeco41 » Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:08 am

SanderO wrote:...Tom's analysis arrived at the ROOSD mechanism using an examination of how the facade (and the surviving core) behaved... plus it includes the observations of the descending crush front inside the facade cage. ROOSD is derived from observation but it has been described in engineering literature. Tom did not invent ROOSD but he has given it an acronym.'....

Whilst assigning the ROOSD acronym was the "marketing initiative" which gave Major_Tom prominence on this initiative it is not IMNSHO the greatest of M_T's achievements with ROOSD.

My opinion is that M_T's greatest achievement with ROOSD is in the extensive and accurate research he has done and published on the ROOSD portion of the "global collapse" or "progression" stage of Twin towers collapses.

One aspect of that work being the identification of how the various bits perimeter broke away, how they fell and where they landed. I am not aware of anything nearly as comprehensive being done or published and I doubt that there has been any work to equal M_T's. I have commended M_T's work on this aspect many times - including on JREF where the naysayers tend to go ballistic at any praise of M_T (or femr2 et al :oops: )

A second aspect of his work has been the differentiation of speeds/movement sequence between the various zones of OOS in their respective towers.

Yes there have been others who have identified the process without the ROOSD label. I was one when I published a broad outline of the process back in 2008 on the then active Richard Dawkins Net Forum. But I stopped at the broad outline - it was all I needed and I do not share M_T's motivation or aptitude for detailed research. Dadeets may remember the Dawkins Forum discussion from the brief time he spent on Dawkins Forum - I'm not sure how the time he was active there overlapped my publishing of the global collapse explanations - I think he came later.

So it is interesting to see M_T's work being used in the setting of an audience of "committed truthers". It may be amusing to see if it attracts the same cynicism in that extreme of the 9/11 polarised debate scene as it does in JREF where many members are biased the other way. I think it could be better received given that the JREF response is mostly driven by the "blue sky" phenomenon directed at M_T rather than what he claims. M_T is branded "truther" on JREF so many members hold to the line that everything he says must be wrong.

Another point in it's favour for Vancouver is the setting that Dadeets gives it:
dadeets wrote:I am assuming separation of initiating OOS floor from columns the indirect result of explosives of some kind. (“Major_Tom” does not claim to provide answers to what exactly initiated ROOSD, or
if it was an intentionally applied force.)
...which is not quite fair to Major_Tom's position. M_T was clearly describing "progression" not "initiation" so it is not an omission on M_T's part to leave out commenting about "initiation". And the Vancouver audience is unlikely to be concerned about the reversal of the logic of proof in the "assumption" of explosives. But we don't need to go there in this thread. :wink:
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